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Author Topic: Slowly breaking everything - 2014 F-150  (Read 358365 times)

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Offline Blown F-150

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Re: Slowly breaking everything - 2014 F-150
« Reply #240 on: May 25, 2017, 11:06:20 PM »
Thanks Guys!

I'm pretty happy with how it turned out.

Next up is the Dyno runs next week. Really curios to see what the numbers will be. I have a rough idea, but still looking forward to real data for my truck.
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Offline Blown F-150

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Re: Slowly breaking everything - 2014 F-150
« Reply #241 on: May 30, 2017, 10:38:42 PM »
Dyno runs all done, but something was off in how they had it set up. I logged the runs and sent to Mike for some input. Stock numbers made sense, but the tuned numbers were off, like way off. There may have even been an issue with how I loaded the tunes (not going back to stock between loads)

I'll see what Mike has to say and go from there. I would like to know what he thinks before I start bolting stuff on. It may even be worth it to hit a different dyno.



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Offline Kitzy

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Re: Slowly breaking everything - 2014 F-150
« Reply #242 on: May 31, 2017, 07:29:40 PM »
Dyno time isn't necessarily cheap is it?  Bummer something seems off.  What kind of numbers are you looking at.  You can't leave that kind of info out!

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Offline Blown F-150

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Re: Slowly breaking everything - 2014 F-150
« Reply #243 on: June 01, 2017, 12:12:55 AM »
Dyno time is not cheap, but the guy seemed to know what he was doing.

Stock the truck put down an expected 281whp, but was a little higher tq wise @ 380wtq (should be about 350-360).

With MPT's biggest tune (93 octane PRX), it made more power from 2400rpm to 4300rpm, but then ended the same as stock higher in the RPM band. So not what it should be. The logs show that it should be making considerably more power than the Dyno was telling us. I don't want to say what the Dyno said because it's not fair to MPT as something was certainly off. Logs were saying around 340whp peak.

I may go do a couple more pulls before I put the Turbos on just in hopes of better numbers, but in the end it doesn't really matter. When the stuff is all bolted on that's when I'll care what it's making.
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Offline Kitzy

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Re: Slowly breaking everything - 2014 F-150
« Reply #244 on: June 01, 2017, 08:48:48 PM »
I'm a little confused as you basically said the truck made the same power tuned as stock but just later in the rpm range with a steeper climb mid-range.  But then you also said you don't want to say what it made unless you were just referring to torque, otherwise you may want to edit.  I understand not wanting to put out any negative vibes toward a company.  Especially before knowing the issue yet.  It's just as important to me that the customer service be as good as the product so if it all gets worked out then it's all good anyway. 

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Offline Blown F-150

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Re: Slowly breaking everything - 2014 F-150
« Reply #245 on: June 02, 2017, 12:14:26 AM »
Yeah, wasn't too clear. I hope this makes more sense.

According to the Dyno, the peak HP numbers were very, very close. According to the logs, the PRX tune made way more peak HP.

According to the Dyno, the PRX tune made more power lower in the RPM band (2400-4300rpm) over the stock tune, but again, not as much as the logs would suggest. The power also dropped off in the upper rpm to match the stock power levels and curve, which is odd.

340whp is what the data in the logs show for what the PRX tune should have made peak, but the Dyno chart is telling a different story. I just don't want to post the sheet more than anything else, as it could easily be copied and tossed around to slander MPT. I personally don't think it's a MPT issue at this point, but working with Mike to see what next steps should be. He has been great and I know he will make sure all is good before the turbos go on.

So, in the end if I had more funds I would hit another Dyno. Since it doesn't really mean much with the planned mods that I'm doing pretty quick, I'm not terribly worried about it.

I will say that I will be VERY suspicious of the Dyno results next time if they show similar numbers. I should be easily over 400whp on that Dyno, even if it reads conservative.

I have been analyzing the logs over the last couple of days. Nothing is really standing out as to why they say I should be making the expected numbers, but the Dyno reads lower. The #/min of air is usually pretty reliable for knowing what the motor is making for power, but I also see really hot intake temps. Lot's of hot air will not make for great numbers, so it MAY be a big factor, especially in the upper RPMs. I'm really hoping the FR intercooler will be here next week. I'll put it in right away and see if it changes anything. I talked to the Dyno shop and they will give me a reduced rate to do a couple of comparative pulls.

It's all in good fun and kinda neat learning how to read logs better and see how this plays out. I'm not racing or chasing a number so it's all good.
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Offline Kitzy

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Re: Slowly breaking everything - 2014 F-150
« Reply #246 on: June 03, 2017, 12:48:51 PM »
So are you leaning towards a Dyno error or just a faulty tune install, not to be confused with a poor tune?  You mentioned maybe it didn't load correctly. 

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Offline Blown F-150

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Re: Slowly breaking everything - 2014 F-150
« Reply #247 on: June 03, 2017, 03:28:59 PM »
Seems to be a combination of Dyno error and Heatsoaking causing power to be pulled. I confirmed similar numbers in the logs, but with less heat soak after I did a complete set to stock, KAM reset and reload of the PR-X 93 tune.

I didn't run it up to 135mph like on the dyno, but ran it WOT for a similar length of time to get comparative logs.

I think Mike's tune is good, 0-60 and 0-80 times drop as they should (1.2/1.6 seconds or so).

At this point, I am just going to wait for the Full-Race intercooler to show up and get to work swapping parts. Due to some other stuff going on in life, I am currently planning on getting it done the last weekend in June. I should be able to get the intercooler in before that and will do some logging again. Curious to see what kind of effect the OEM 2/3rds block CAC has.
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Offline Kitzy

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Re: Slowly breaking everything - 2014 F-150
« Reply #248 on: June 04, 2017, 06:19:39 AM »
I agree with doing the install.  Having all of the actual numbers to compare would be cool but ultimately worthless to you and therefore not worth the extra money for more Dyno time.  Knowing what you're putting down in the end on the other hand it fun info to have.

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Offline Blown F-150

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Re: Slowly breaking everything - 2014 F-150
« Reply #249 on: June 05, 2017, 04:22:44 PM »
Starting to find out more as we look into it. Mike reviewed some of my logs from last night and confirms that the "94" octane here, just isn't. Probably closer to 90-91 based on the timing being pulled. So that is factor number 3. Good to know there is actually some reasons for things being off. I have been doing some checking and other performance enthusiasts are claiming the same about our crappy gas.

Mike sent me a revision to adjust for it and I'll do some more logging after I try gas from another brand. He's happy to review logs now as it will help when he goes to build the tune for the Turbo's and other goodies.

Off to burn some more ridiculously priced gas!
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Offline Blown F-150

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Re: Slowly breaking everything - 2014 F-150
« Reply #250 on: June 05, 2017, 04:23:45 PM »
Oh, and the truck got a quick wash in the dark last night too.

This is a detailing forum after all... :uugly:
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Offline Kitzy

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Re: Slowly breaking everything - 2014 F-150
« Reply #251 on: June 05, 2017, 04:47:13 PM »
I always use Shell gas when I can.  Next choice is Sunoco.  Sunoco is the only place I've ever seen 94 around here.  Sometimes you can't even find 93, only 92.  Makes you wonder though what you're actually putting in and you cant help but worry when it's recommended to run high octane and it might not be.

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Offline Blown F-150

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Re: Slowly breaking everything - 2014 F-150
« Reply #252 on: June 05, 2017, 05:14:45 PM »
The issue is that Chevron is the only brand here that lists anything above 91, so since it's not good for a 93 tune, I don't have any other options.

So, we'll give it a shot with gas from a different station, but I'm guessing that I'm ending up with a 91 tune. In all honesty, I'm fine with it as I'm not going to start mixing aviation fuel or VP additives/race fuel. That would be kind of ridiculous for 20hp.
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Offline Kitzy

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Re: Slowly breaking everything - 2014 F-150
« Reply #253 on: June 05, 2017, 05:26:39 PM »
How do you trust it though?  I think I'd try to contact Chevron and see what they say about your discovery.  Maybe they don't even know and it's a certain station trying to pull a fast one.

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Offline Blown F-150

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Re: Slowly breaking everything - 2014 F-150
« Reply #254 on: June 05, 2017, 05:53:39 PM »
I'm trying to contact a dude on another forum that was actually able to test a bunch of gas brands for Octane rating. From what he has posted online (specific to this area) is that our 94 gas is actually 91 and the 91 is 90. Somehow they are getting away with it due to their "Method" of calculating the octane rating. Shell seems to be the most honest.

Looks like quite a few others have raised it to Chevron and it's gone nowhere, even guys that have blown up engines.
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